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 09-19-2019, 09:05 PM | #1 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Jake brake on 2 cylinders only?? This is a 2004 Dynasty, Cummins 400. I would like to know if the ecm supplies the voltage to the 2 solenoids from a single wire and one splits off to route to the high/low switch? Or are there 2 separate leads coming out of the ecm? I want to jump the second solenoid from the first to see if it goes on 4 cylinders. If not I'll have to put in a temporary relay to run the two solenoids to not damage the ecm. This will let me know if it is an internal problem or electrical. My switch is working but the 2 wires dissappear into what the book calls a HILLAM. Best I can tell it's an outsourced wiring harness. Does the switch send voltage to the ecm or just ground the 2 ecm signal inputs? Thanks |
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| 09-19-2019, 09:57 PM | #2 | |||
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: So Cal Posts: 1,205 | If you watch the video you will See Exactly how a Jake Brake works. The ECM does control the switching but it controls oil solenoids which intern Retard the Exhaust Valve Timing to the very last moment of the piston stroke, via the engines oil pressure. I listed this video because it is a common problem loosing oil pressure at solenoids, could be your problem. Dont Mess With The ECM
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| 09-19-2019, 10:13 PM | #3 |
| Member Monaco Owners Club Join Date: May 2018 Location: WC,PA Posts: 98 | Unfortunately I can�t answer your question, but maybe you can help answer a easy one. 2003 Dynasty Bishop 400 Cummings with a 3 or 6 cylinder J brake depending on the rocker switch position. If the top of the rocker switch is down, is that the HI position with all cylinders providing the breaking or just 3. I have a foot pedal that triggers the brake activation. Depressed � on, release � off. I�m just not sure of which rocker position provides max braking. I�m assuming HI is top down. |
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| 09-19-2019, 10:58 PM | #4 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Quote: Originally Posted by f365gt4 Unfortunately I can�t answer your question, but maybe you can help answer a easy one. 2003 Dynasty Bishop 400 Cummings with a 3 or 6 cylinder J brake depending on the rocker switch position. If the top of the rocker switch is down, is that the HI position with all cylinders providing the breaking or just 3. I have a foot pedal that triggers the brake activation. Depressed � on, release � off. I�m just not sure of which rocker position provides max braking. I�m assuming HI is top down. Pushing the front down is high |
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| 09-20-2019, 07:09 AM | #5 |
| Community Administrator Newmar Owners Club Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 17,818 | This is a manual that shows the basic wiring diagram and how the Jacobs brake is setup as mentioned above most of the older setups are Hi and Low which is 3 or 6 cylinders. Jacobs 490A Install.pdf __________________ |
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| 09-20-2019, 09:54 AM | #6 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 233 | Shootist - on my 99 M11 the jake brake coil wires run directly from the ECM to the coils - you can see them alongside the valve cover on top of the intake. There is a weatherpack connector for that harness at the forward end, there is a jumper harness in there that connects the wire to the engine brake light relay to the low coil - I could see where those connections could be an issue.... On mine the jumper can be removed and the harness plugged in without it, you just lose the brake light activation while on the Jake. __________________ |
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| 09-20-2019, 07:08 PM | #7 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Thank you both! It looks like I can install the jumper and both should work if it's not mechanical. If it's mechanical it'll be cheaper but I hate getting greasy these days. Haha |
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| 09-21-2019, 12:23 AM | #8 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 233 | I might have misread the Hillam wiring diagram - here is the wiring diagram I found in the Jacobs troubleshooting manual I have.... __________________ |
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| 09-21-2019, 07:03 AM | #9 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Thank you Kurt. I need to talk to a cummins tech to ask if I can jump the solenoid or switch wires front to back. I don't know if the ecm has to chop all the fuel or if the jake can operate with an idle speed supply of fuel still available to the cylinders. |
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| 09-21-2019, 07:07 AM | #10 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,249 | Quote: Originally Posted by shootist This is a 2004 Dynasty, Cummins 400. I would like to know if the ecm supplies the voltage to the 2 solenoids from a single wire and one splits off to route to the high/low switch? Or are there 2 separate leads coming out of the ecm? I want to jump the second solenoid from the first to see if it goes on 4 cylinders. If not I'll have to put in a temporary relay to run the two solenoids to not damage the ecm. This will let me know if it is an internal problem or electrical. My switch is working but the 2 wires dissappear into what the book calls a HILLAM. Best I can tell it's an outsourced wiring harness. Does the switch send voltage to the ecm or just ground the 2 ecm signal inputs? Thanks Attached are two pages from the 03 Dynasty wiring book related to the Engine brake. Hope it helps. If you want the whole book, just PM me with your email address. It's a PDF of about 90k so it may take a bit toi download if you're on a slow connection. __________________ |
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Rick P. '05 Signature | 09-21-2019, 11:09 AM | #11 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Got it RPasetto, thankyou very much. |
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| 09-21-2019, 02:16 PM | #12 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Both solenoids click with 12v. Both show .02 ohms on my lowest scale on the meter. I thought they were to be .5 to .2 , pretty sure it's just me reading the meter wrong. 2 wires go down towards the ecm and two from a breakout to the harnesses on the rt frame rail. I will climb under it when I raise it up to leave here. Don't want to bother the neighbors. What I really want to know if it is a single 12volt wire that feeds both from the ecm because then I could jump them together cutting the hi/lo circuit out of the equation. That would very quickly tell me if it is electrical or a mechanical problem in the jake. |
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| 09-21-2019, 03:22 PM | #13 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,249 | Looked in my Dynasty wiring book but was not able to locate the solenoids you mention. Here attached is another page which shows the two engine brake switches and other components on the shifter panel. Note that the wiring runs to a 12-pin connector... there are at least a dozen of these for different purposes. I tried to find the page corresponding to the relays you mention but could not. (Again you are welcome to the whole wiring book if you want it. It's kind of cumbersome to use, just a PDF with images of pages and not text-searchable. Monaco used to have that & other info available online for download, back in the day.) __________________ |
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| 09-21-2019, 03:34 PM | #14 |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,700 | Thankyou Rick, the solenoids are under the valve cover. I have the same wiring manual for my coach. 2004 dynasty only is slightly different, they added a plug m108 and put the two jake hi/lo wires to it. It's not knowing what I should be seeing for voltages and where the wires come out in the rear. If the ecm sends 2 separate signals to the engine then I cannot switch them or jump the to test the mechanicals. I have no idea if I can manually send 12v to the solenoids while running without damaging the motor if the ecm is still firing the injectors. |
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